Subject: new IMAP server, unwanted flags behavior

From: Kenneth Crudup <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 17:32:57 -0700 (PDT)

We've just moved from a Cyrus IMAP server to Courier here at Panix, and
ever since the change, E-mail in one Pine session that's read still
shows up as "N"ew in the INBOX LIST of other sessions (unless you close/
eopen the INBOX, which I can't seem to figure out how to do w/o leaving
Pine altogether).

Here's the relevant parts of the E-mail from Panix staff:

----
Courier (the new server) doesn't create separate index files the way
Cyrus did.  The huge advantage to this is that you can move email
files around directly from the command line, without having to rebuild
the whole mail overview database each time.  The disadvantage is that
your mail status is no longer quite as dynamic, and your folder will
synchronize only when you close it.
----

... which sucks, 'cause I have a Pine session running at work, on the
laptop, and at home, and I get home and it looks like I've got a bunch
of new messages, when they're really all or mostly read.

So, is there something I can change/patch to make Pine (I'm running 4.56)
force the server to get me the new flags, and failing that, is there a
way to resynch IMAP INBOXes short of exiting/restarting Pine?

	-Kenny

-- 
Kenneth R. Crudup  Sr. SW Engineer, Scott County Consulting, Los Angeles
H: 3801 E. Pacific Coast Hw #9, Long Beach, CA 90804-2014 (888) 454-8181
W: 2052 Alton Parkway, Irvine, CA 92606-4905	     (949) 252-1111-X240
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---

From: Kenneth Crudup <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 10:39:54 -0700 (PDT)

On Tue, 24 Jun 2003, Simon White wrote:

> If you leave for another folder, and then come back to the INBOX, is the
> status maintained? Usually leaving the INBOX for another folder, and then
> coming back, forces a close/reopen...

It didn't for the limited, small case I tried. I guess there's some
caching going on.

	-Kenny

---

From: Nancy McGough <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2003 09:55:50 +0100 (BST)

> We've just moved from a Cyrus IMAP server to Courier here at Panix, and

That's very interesting... It seems to me that most of the good
IMAP providers are going the other way, especially now that
Mulberry supports user-defined labels and Courier doesn't support
that.

Anyway, I just updated the panix.com section of my IMAP Service
Providers page to reflect this, but I need details about the
INBOX specification. Does this work:

 {mail.panix.com/user=UID/ssl}INBOX

or do you need /novalidate-cert? What about using /tls instead of
/ssl -- does that work?

> eopen the INBOX, which I can't seem to figure out how to do w/o leaving

I think that this is what the folder-reopen-rule is for. Try
setting it to 'Always reopen', i.e.:

 folder-reopen-rule               =
            Set    Rule Values
            ---  ----------------------
            (*)  Always reopen
            ( )  Yes for POP/NNTP, Ask about other remote [Yes]
            ( )  Yes for POP/NNTP, Ask about other remote [No]
            ( )  Yes for POP/NNTP, No for other remote
            ( )  Always ask [Yes]
            ( )  Always ask [No]
            ( )  Ask about POP/NNTP [Yes], No for other remote
            ( )  Ask about POP/NNTP [No], No for other remote
            ( )  Never reopen

And then go to your Folder List and type > on your INBOX and see
if that closes and reopens it.

Let us know if that helps,
Thanks,
Nancy

--
Nancy McGough            <http://www.ii.com>            Infinite Ink
Writing about procmail, imap, pine, spam-deflexion strategies & more

---

From: Kenneth Crudup <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2003 09:26:10 -0700 (PDT)

> > We've just moved from a Cyrus IMAP server to Courier here at Panix

On Wed, 25 Jun 2003, Nancy McGough wrote:

> IMAP providers are going the other way

Well, I'm not happy with it. It's slower, and it doesn't sync against my
other sessions.

> What about using /tls instead of /ssl -- does that work?
> or do you need /novalidate-cert?

"/tls" or "/ssl" work with Panix, but they've got some weirdness in the
certificate they're using, so you *have* to include "/novalidate-cert".

>             Set    Rule Values

It doesn't reopen for me, maybe I have to enter another folder?

	-Kenny

---

From: Nancy McGough <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2003 19:20:16 +0100 (BST)

> Well, I'm not happy with it. It's slower, and it doesn't sync against my

What do other Panix people think about it? Any interesting
discussion happening in the panix.* newsgroups?

> certificate they're using, so you *have* to include "/novalidate-cert".

Thanks, I'll add that to my IMAP page.

> It doesn't reopen for me, maybe I have to enter another folder?

I don't know how folder-reopen-rule is supposed to work on IMAP
folders. The Help is mainly about POP and NNTP folders -- could
someone on the Pine team explain what's the easiest way to close
and reopen an IMAP folder? I'm interested in this too because I
have mail-check-interval set to 0 and I sometimes want to
manually close and re-open and IMAP box. (But most of the time I
just cycle around my incoming-folders loop!)

Thanks,
Nancy

---

From: Kenneth Crudup <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2003 11:35:21 -0700 (PDT)

> discussion happening in the panix.* newsgroups?

Most people on Panix seem to get their mail via the shell, with some
folks using other MUAs like LookOut! and Netscape/Mozilla. But I seem
to be the only one who cares about the sync problem.

	-Kenny

---

From: Steve Hubert <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 27 Jun 2003 17:08:44 -0700 (PDT)

> just cycle around my incoming-folders loop!)

Since it isn't supposed to be useful to re-open a ReadWrite IMAP folder
pine doesn't give you a way to do it. With mail-check-interval set to 0
you can still manually check for new mail by typing ^L.

To work around this problem I guess you could use the fact that pine
treats the inbox specially, by keeping it open. If you set your inbox to
something you don't care about and make the real inbox be one of the other
folders, then when you go from the real inbox to the fake inbox the real
inbox will be closed.

Steve Hubert - Univ of Washington