Subject: Problem with text insertion

From: thomas c squillante <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 7 Aug 1999 18:39:04 -0700 (PDT)

Whenever I insert text in a Pine e-mail note it strikes over instead. 
Then when I scroll I see that it was really inserted after all.

I dial-up to an HP UNIX server with HyperTerminal Private Edition 4.0.

Thanks.

Tom
City College of San Francisco

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From: Jessica Rasku <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 7 Aug 1999 21:16:19 -0700 (PDT)

> Then when I scroll I see that it was really inserted after all.

	This sounds like a terminal problem.  It really doesn't sound like
a Pine problem at all, as it is doing what you want it to...  

> I dial-up to an HP UNIX server with HyperTerminal Private Edition 4.0.

	HyperTerminal (if it's related to the HyperTerminal that ships
with Win95), is not known to be a good terminal program.  That is
unfortunate.  It's unfortunate that many terminal programs are not
``good'' for whatever reason...

							Jessica

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From: Mark Peletier <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 12:39:44 +0200

> a Pine problem at all, as it is doing what you want it to...  

Hmmm - I'm not quite sure about this. I have the same problem when
pasting into an SGI winterm (in fact a wsh shell). The problem is simple -
the UNIX newline character is ^J, but in Pine ^J has an additional meaning
as the `Jusify Paragraph' command. What Pine sees coming in is a sequence
of lines separated by ^J characters, i.e. by Justify commands, and
acts accordingly - rewriting the paragraph after every `newline'. 
Such a rewrite leaves the cursor at the end of the paragraph, and
therefore the next line is inserted at the end of the current
paragraph, rather than at the place the cursor was when the
^J arrived. This gives exactly the behaviour that Thomas describes.

What I don't understand is why I get this behaviour when I
insert into a winterm/wsh, but everything goes fine when
I insert into an xterm. Could anyone enlighten me on this?

Mark Peletier

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From: Jessica Rasku <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 11:44:25 -0700 (PDT)

> ^J arrived. This gives exactly the behaviour that Thomas describes.

	Um, it's entirely possible that I didn't understand the problem.
Yes, this is a real problem that does exist when you do a ``text
transfer'' from any machine to pine.  By text insert, I thought that we
were talking about doing a ^R, in Pine, which is a diffrent thing.  Which
may appear to do what it sounds like it is doing, on a slow terminal (I
can't tell right now as I'm local to my Pine, and my system isn't loaded
enough that I can tell if it actually displays as it's inserting, or not).  
	This is STILL a terminal problem, as the terminal does not
recognise that it should use ^M for EOL, not ^J or ^M^J, or anything else.
It is unfortunate that Pine has chosen to use the ^J character for
Justify.  
	Considering that the initial message said something to the effect
of ``it looks like it is overwriting, but when I rewrite the screen it
has done what I expect it to do'' it does NOT sound like the same problem,
doing ^L does NOT change anything about the actuall contents, only clears
the screen and rewrites it.

> I insert into an xterm. Could anyone enlighten me on this?

	I have no familiarity with winterm/wsh.  I'd say that you have
DEFINATELY proven that this is NOT a Pine bug, by showing that changing
how you access Pine changes the behaviour.