Subject: Re: Help - address display in header fields

From: "Ed Greshko" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1998 23:55:32 +0800

Mike, Timothy, Colin and other have had some very good suggestions as
to how users of pine (and other mailers) can prevent *sending* of large
To: lists.

The problem is that you very seldom have control over what *others* send
you.  Yes, there are times you can send suggestions.  But, equally, there
are times when you can't or dare not.  The result of not being able to
control what is being sent to you can be annoying.  In this particular case,
a long list of recipients with each on a single line.

If you can't control what is being sent to you...what are the alternatives?

Some have suggested a process which chops off some of the To:'s and puts
them
in a safe place for later reference.  This seems fine for those inclined to
do the work of putting things back together.  However, it seems to defeat
the
purpose of having a computer to make things easier.  Also, it is seems to be
solution which may be to complex for the average user.  (Not all users of
pine
have a Masters in computer science.  :-) )

So, what choice is left?  Well, maybe there are 2 solutions.

1.  Revert to the old viewer of pine where more than one recipients is shown
on a line.

2.  Modify pine to display a "maximum recipient" list with an indication
that the remainder
    of the list is suppressed and that key "x" should be hit to reveal the
full list.

Just some ideas.....

Regards,
Ed

--
Edward M. Greshko                  Technical Manager, Electronic Commerce
GSM: +65-9751-0860                 Control Data Asia/Pacific Region
PGPKey-ID:CA3AFA5D  Fingerprint: 2DE6 5527 144E D1BC  3C55 9FA5 518E 52EE

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From: Andrew Sweger <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1998 09:58:14 -0700

"Ed Greshko" <[email-masked]>,Internet writes:
>that the remainder of the list is suppressed and that key "x" should be
>hit to reveal the
>full list.

I'd like to propose using ^R as the key for this purpose. The mnemonic
is already in place (display rich headers). The maximum number of
recipients to display (in colapsed view) should also be user
configurable. Example (max-recipient = 1):

Date: Tue, 23 Dec 1997 12:29:18 -0800 (PST)
From: Everything You Want <[email-masked]>
To: Andrew Sweger <[email-masked]>
    (recipient list suppressed, press ^R to display full list)
Subject: FREE $TUFF - FREE $TUFF

-- 
Andrew B. Sweger - Computer Support Manager - [email-masked]
Department of Family Medicine  -  University of Washington
Box 354696  -  Seattle  -  WA  -  98195-4696  -  (206) 616-9208
_-*^*-_-*^*-_-*^*-_-*^*-_-*^*-_-*^*-_-*^*-_-*^*-_-*^*-_-*^*-_-*^*-_-*^*-
Report computer problems to Computer Support <[email-masked]>

---

From: Adam Baker <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1998 20:39:21 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time)

Please advice me what do I have to do in order to unsubscribe
the <[email-masked]>.
Thanks.

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From: "Colin J. Raven" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1998 20:13:47 -0700

Yes, but if you were on *that* particular track, wouldn't it make sense to
do the following;
1. why not chop the To;'s, save a copy of the mail as a text file, and cat
the chopped To;'s into the text file just created?
>them in a safe place for later reference.
-
You wouldn't have to put things back together, if you wanted the "bare bones
version" (minus To:'s) it would be pruned 'n ready in the inbox. If you
wanted to view the whole horrible mess, well pico/emacs/jove/vi/LaTeX
(whatever) the (suitably titled) text file for the exquisite details.
>This seems fine for those inclined to do the work of putting things back
together.
-
I dunno Ed, if you can write the stuff to accomplish the task, er....I think
the 'puter just did make things easier...nicht so?
>However, it seems to defeat
>the purpose of having a computer to make things easier.

I would ask the question at this point....is the "average user" the one who
wants clean mail, minus all the To:'s? My sense of it is probably that's not
the case.
I've gotten the usual "funnies" forwarded (yet one *more* fwd) from
newcomers, and more sage users alike. Both groups blithely read and
forward/bounce email with the most atrocious list of To:'s on 'em. Maybe
it's only after a while that quality and style become an issue. Maybe it's
just us folks that agonize endlessly over matters such as this. I think the
crop of newcomers over the past couple of years or so regard all the crap in
badly composed email as "normal". It's the dumbing down of the Internet
poulation as a whole I think. If no one teaches you style, how do you become
a discriminating user?
Bottom line is this I think; Advanced users want advanced capabilities.
Absent those built in capabilities, the annoying stuff gets fixed by the
advanced user...in a an advanced way. The average user learns if interested
(and irked by the flaw) or lives with the problem in blissful ignorance or
uncaring oblivion.
>Also, it is seems to be solution which may be to complex for the average
user.

Yup, me for starters, though Gawd...how I wish........<sigh>
>(Not all users of pine have a Masters in computer science.  :-) )

Modifying Pine would probably be the way to go IMHO. A feature that would
enable you to view abbreviated To:'s would be the functional equivalent of
the "h" (show/hide headers) a feature that I personally find invaluable.
I vividly recall a distinguished fellow list member who seemed to be so at
home actually modifying a mail client to do his esoteric bidding (elm
emulation keymappings I think?), that he assumed immediate Godlike status in
my eyes :) Is it *that* easy? I think perhaps not!
>So, what choice is left?  Well, maybe there are 2 solutions.
[listing of proposed solutions]

Well, that's my $.02 worth,
I'm amazed that U.Wash modifies a globally used email prograsm in response
to user's suggestions at all!
That blew me away at the beginning, and still does. One of the dozens of
reasons I love the program.
'Night Everyone...
-Colin.
-----------------------------------------
Colin J. Raven
Operations Manager, HDS Lab, Inc.
Costa Mesa, CA  |  Harrison, NY
(714) 428 0300  |  (914) 835 2200