Subject: mailing lists - coping

From: Andrew Vardy <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 1997 23:36:29 -0230 (NDT)

I want to know how to cope with mailing lists.  I don't think this has
ever been mentioned before.  Never seen anyone discuss it.

How does one cope with a flurry of messages from a very many high-volume
mailing lists?  How to keep it all remotely manageable, and be able to
locate important messages?  Pine does not let you subdivide mail that
comes in according to lists.  All mail goes simply in one INBOX.

Now saving mail with 's' command, I press that, and then can type some
folder.  I can never there after be able to locate it.  It will put it in
a folder.  Kind of hard going from folder to folder.  Anyway, once I do
this, my quota gets ever narrower.  I have a very small allowable file
size quota.  The INBOX interestingly does not take up quota space.  But
all other folders add up the total file size space towards the quota.
That quota draws up quick!

I don't really have any interesting method of systematically moving
messages saving them filing them away, downloading, to do this quickly
enough so the INBOX would stay under 50-100 messages.  And if I start
simply deleting a lot, and frequently, then I will definitely be deleting
messages that are important/relevant to me, and would at least like to
refer to sometime.

I need advice.  Is there any?  Or is Pine too old to manage this type of
mail difficulty/organization?

---

From: Mike Brudenell <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 1997 10:24:48 +0100 (BST)

> comes in according to lists.  All mail goes simply in one INBOX.

True.  But then, like many other mail programs, Pine is a "Mail User
Agent".  This means it provides you the user with a (hopefully) pleasant
to use interface to reading your e-mail AFTER it has been delivered into
one or more folders.

Pine plays _no part_ in the mail delivery process itself.  If you want
different mailing lists' messages delivered to different folders then it
is this _delivery process_ you need to persuade, not Pine.  This is
achieved by setting up a filter: the delivery system passes the incoming
message to your filter, which is then responsible for deciding which
folder to write the message to.

You should ask your local Help Desk whether filtering is available on your
computer systems and, if so, how to use it.

If you do go down this route you will find Pine's
"enable-incoming-folders" option (in its Setup Configuration screen)
useful.  Turning this on creates a new "collection" of folders in your
"Folder List" screen ("L" command from Main Menu, Message Index or a
number of other places).  This initially just contains your INBOX.
However you can Add ("A" command) other folders )the ones you filter
your incoming mail into) to this collection.

Normally the Tab command advances you to the next New (Unseen) message in
the current folder.  If you are reading one of several folders in an
incoming collection and have reached the last such message then Tab checks
following incoming folders for recently arrived mail and, if any id found,
offers to let you view them.  This means you can work your way through all
your incoming folders in turn simply by pressing the Tab key (deleting,
saving, printing, etc, messages as you work through them).

> a folder.  Kind of hard going from folder to folder.

Really?  Here are different ways you can move from one folder to another.
Some are better than others if you can remember a folder's name (or the
start of the name).  They assume you are in the Folder Index screen...

*  Press "L" (List Folders);
   Use Arrow Keys to highlight the folder of interest in the list shown;
   Press Return.

*  Press "G" (Goto Folder);
   Type in the full name of the folder of interest;
   Press Return.

*  Press "G" (Goto Folder);
   Type in the first few characters of the name of the folder of interest;
   Press Tab to complete the folder name automatically;
   Press Return.
	(This requires the "enable-tab-completion" to be turned on in
	your Setup Configuration screen.)

*  Press "G" (Goto Folder);
   Press ^T (To Folders) to see the List Folders screen;
   Use Arrow Keys to highlight the folder of interest in the list shown;
   Press Return.

> Anyway, once I do this, my quota gets ever narrower.  I have a very
> small allowable file size quota.  The INBOX interestingly does not take
> up quota space.  But all other folders add up the total file size space
> towards the quota.  That quota draws up quick!

It sounds like you site does as we do... your INBOX is probably held on a
separate, special disk on your mail server.  However messaages you decide
to keep are saved to folders in your normal disk store.  Because the
former is a separate disk it has a separate quota for you (or perhaps even
no quota at all).

This is a fair way of working because it tries to make sure you always
have a reasonable chance of having space to receive newly arriving
messages (in your INBOX, on the mail server).  However if you decide to
keep various messages for future reference it seems right and proper that
they should be saved in your normal directory and charged against its disk
quota; you must learn to balance the desire to hoard messages against the
other demands on your disk space -- everything in this world has a cost!

If you find your disk quota vanishing rapidly then in the first instance
sort through your folders and delete any messages and/or folders you no
longer require.

If you are still short of disk space contact your local Help Desk for
advice; they may even be willing to increase your quota.

> messages that are important/relevant to me, and would at least like to

I suggest you persue the route I suggest above and enquire about
filtering.

If this is not available to you then you can emulate it to some extent
using a combination of Pine's Select, Zoom, Sort and Apply commands...

1.  Select the messages you want to operate on (this requires the
"enable-aggregate-command-set" option to be turned on in your Setup
Configuration screen)...

For example, to select all New messages:
	; S N
Or to select all messages send "To" the pine-info list:
	; T T pine-info

2.  Having selected some messages (they'll be shown in bold, or with an
"X" in the first column) hide the others from view by using the Zoom
command:
	Z
(To later unzoom, and view them all again, use another "Z" command.)
This lets you concentrate on just the selected messages.

3.  Sort the messages into threaded conversations using the "Ordered
Subject" sort key:
	$ O

4.  Go to the top message in the list:
	^W ^Y
and then start working through reading them, deleting any you do not want
to keep en route.

5.  Use the Expunge command to (permanently) get rid of the deleted
message in your selection:
	X

6.  Now decide what you want to do with any still left selected... you can
operate on them all in one go by using the Apply (A) command: 
	A Y		... applies a Print command to them all
	A S foldername	... applies a Save command to them all, to move
			    them into another folder
	etc

7.  If there are still any messages selected, "drop" them by using the
Select -> Unselect All command:
	; A
(This will automatically unzoom.  If you want to unzoom without
deselecting just give the "Z' command a second time now.)

> I need advice.  Is there any?

See above.  :-)

> Or is Pine too old to manage this type of mail difficulty/organization? 

Nope, it's fine... you just haven't yet experimented enough with it and/or
read its help pages and put 2 + 2 together to see how they can be applied
to your particular need.

Cheers,

-- 
Mike Brudenell                                         <[email-masked]>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Computing Service, University of York, Heslington, York, YO1 5DD, UK
Tel: +44-1904-433811  FAX: +44-1904-433740  http://www.york.ac.uk/~pmb1/

* Unsolicited commercial e-mail is NOT welcome at this e-mail address. *