Subject: Re: Filters

From: Paul O Bartlett <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 18:14:03 -0400

On Sun, 16 Jun 1996, Carolann Mercer wrote:

> Hi can I set Pine to filter out unwanted messages...I have the senders 
> name but don't know how to block, can anyone help?
> Thanks 
> C-Ann

    This question comes up on this newsgroup probably at least once a
week.  It really ought to be made clearer in the Pine documentation.

    To answer the question: Pine will not filter messages for you. 
It has no capability to do so.  You have to use some program or
process to filter the mail before Pine gets hold of it.  Under Un*x,
procmail and (Elm) filter are two widely used programs.

    If you have a World Wide Web browser, browse my home page, follow
the link to Pine and mail filtering, and follow the next link to
Nancy McGough's WWW pages.  She has a lot of useful information on mail
filetering.

Paul                             <[email-masked]>
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Paul O. Bartlett, P.O. Box 857, Vienna, VA 22183-0857, USA
Finger, keyserver, or WWW for PGP 2.6.2 public key 
Home Page:  URL: http://www.access.digex.net/~pobart

---

From: Paul O Bartlett <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 17 Jun 1996 10:50:16 -0400

On Sun, 16 Jun 1996, Neil Marsh wrote:

> On Sun, 16 Jun 1996, Paul O Bartlett wrote:
> >
> Then what is the whole section about filtering and filtering tokens
> for in the help file for 'display-filters' in Setup Configuration?
> Is that what you should be entering in the procmail or elm programs?
> If so, the help file is VERY much in need of revising.

    With the newest versions of Pine, a terminological confusion has
come into play.  Prior to Pine 3.93, when people talked about
"filters," usually they were referring to mail filters in a generic
sense which had nothing specifically to to with Pine as such but with
email processing in general.  This is probably what people who have
been around even a relatively short time think of concerning the word
"filter" in connection with email.  I did, and that's how I took
Carolann Mercer's inquiry.  (I use procmail quite effectively and
simply have had no reason to go looking for new such capability within
Pine itself.)

    However, Pine 3.93 introduced some kind of "filter" of it's own,
which I have not even had any reason to look at.  I'm not even sure
what it does.  What has happened is that the terminological waters have
gotten muddied up with Pine 3.93's use of "filter" when commonly, up to
that point and outside Pine's own, narrow world, "filter" had its own
(possibly different) meaning.  If Pine 3.93/3.94 can in fact "filter"
mail in the non-Pine sense, then I stand corrected and encourage those
more knowledgeable about the new capability to enlighten us.

    Terry Gray, are you there?

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From: Terry Gray <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 17 Jun 1996 09:55:43 -0700 (PDT)

Paul,
Pine's use of the term filter follows from Unix filters, circa 1969,
so that usage long predates the term as applied to procmail-like
"mail filtering"...

But you are entirely correct: Pine still does not do "mail filtering" in
the sense of separating incoming messages into different folders.  We view
this as best done at the time the message is delivered, rather than when
the Mail User Agent (e.g. Pine) is invoked.  So procmail and similar
programs are still the recommended solution for this need.

Pine's filters are for special processing of a message at the point it is
displayed or sent.  Examples might include character set manipulation or
encryption/decryption.

-teg

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From: Neil Marsh <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 17 Jun 1996 18:06:31 GMT

On 17 Jun 1996, Terry Gray wrote:
>
>But you are entirely correct: Pine still does not do "mail
>filtering" in the sense of separating incoming messages into
>different folders.  We view this as best done at the time the
>message is delivered, rather than when the Mail User Agent (e.g.
>Pine) is invoked.  So procmail and similar programs are still the
>recommended solution for this need. 
>
>Pine's filters are for special processing of a message at the point
>it is displayed or sent.  Examples might include character set
>manipulation or encryption/decryption. 

So, does this mean I can't use Pine's filters as a kill file for
reading my newsgroups by having files with the undesired topics
shunted off to the temporary file for deletion after the session is
over?

---
Neil Marsh <[email-masked]>                         Cambridge, MA

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From: Terry Gray <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 18 Jun 1996 08:59:17 -0700 (PDT)

Correct.  Kill files are not yet supported, and procmail-like tools only
apply to mail, not news.  Sorry...

-teg

---

From: Carolann Mercer <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 09:52:04 -0700

---

From: Mike Brudenell <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 21 Jun 1996 20:08:38 +0100 (BST)

If you are talking about e-mail messages...

...you can't do this with *any* mail reading program (they are for reading
messages AFTER they have been delivered).  Instead you need to persuade
the mail *delivery* software on your computer to redirect/junk the
messages as they arrive.  Typically this is done using a UNIX program such
as "procmail" or "filter".  Ask your local Help Desk which, if any, of
these are available on your system and how to use them.

If you are talking about Usenet News messages...

...you can't (the current version of Pine doesn't support "kill files").

Cheers,

Mike Brudenell                                         <[email-masked]>
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